PODCAST TRANSCRIPT:

Ian R
Hey, Mike, welcome back to Inspector Toolbelt Talk. How are you?

Mike Ortiz
Doing good. I’m good, man. How are you doing?

Ian R
Hey, not bad. You know, I feel like we have a magnifying glass on your life sometimes. You were on the show starting out. And then you were on the show when you first went multi inspector, you were on the show when you’re growing. And now you’ve, you’ve gotten quite a big, decent sized home inspection company doing really well for yourself. And I just feel like, I don’t know, it’s like a montage, like a movie, like you could play all these episodes together and watch you grow from beginner to, you know, industry veteran. So thank you for being back on the show.

Mike Ortiz
I appreciate that. I think sometimes it feels like, it’s not, it’s not easy. And I hardly feel like the grown up in the room most of the time, you know, but I think it just comes down to learning from, I make a lot of mistakes, like as many successes as I have, I made, I made a lot of mistakes. And I think now I, and I’m okay, revealing them, so that anybody else can avoid making those same mistakes and kind of learn from it. Because I wish somebody was there to kind of tell me the same thing.

Ian R
Yeah, and that’s why we appreciate guys like you being on the show, sharing your experience, sharing information that one of our listeners said one time he goes, you’d have to pay somebody 1000s of dollars and spend days and weeks with them just trying to figure this stuff out. And you guys just come on the show and, and talk about it for free. You know, it’s not like we’re paying you to be on here. But you’re just helping the industry. And I appreciate that. But today, we have a very specific subject, and you actually pitched this to me, and I really liked the concept. We’re going to talk about basically military, veterans, police, firefighters, first responders, and things along those lines, people along those lines, and why they should consider being in the home inspection industry. And why if we are a home inspection company, we should consider hiring them. Or third, if we’re just a single inspector, and we don’t have any of that background, why we should get to know some of those people in our industry and in our area. And this is something that, something that I really appreciate, because I’ve said this a lot, whenever a police officer, a veteran calls me and they say, I want to get into the home, home inspection industry. One of the first things I say is perfect, you were built for this. And we’re gonna go over some of the reasons why, but some of the most successful people I’ve seen in the industry have a military background. Juan Jimenez, he teased me one time, I said ex-marine on one of our podcasts. I’m like, oh, no, not an ex Marine, a Marine. Once a Marine, always a Marine, right? And firefighters, why these guys do so well in our industry. And so there’s a little bit of something in this for all of us whether we’re of one of those backgrounds or not. But what made this come to your, come to your mind as a podcast theme there, Mike?

Mike Ortiz
Yeah, a little bit of background for me, when I was 17 and a half, I joined the Army, this was back in 2000, the end of 2005/2006, I believe. And I really, I needed my parents to sign the form in order for me to join because I was underage. And it, what it really did was it opened my eyes to a lot of accountability, discipline, patience, being able to deal with harsh conditions and environments in order to be able to have that kind of patience. You know, I wasn’t the smartest guy I was, uh, when I did my my ASVAB test, I only qualified for infantry, which, you know, turns out it’s not, the it’s not the, it’s not the hardest job to get but it feels like the hardest job to do at the time. And when I deployed overseas, especially in Iraq, a lot of this stuff that went on, a lot of the things that I had to do and saw, it put a lot of things in perspective for me, and I know that a lot of fellow veterans and even first responders have dealt with high stress situations that focus them, you know, focus them and give them experience that you wouldn’t be able to get in the civilian world or otherwise. And what happens afterwards is that while you’re struggling to transition from that high octane, high stress life that you’re used to, where you’re always on edge and everything, transitioning is difficult. So one of the things that’s important is finding something that that you can be proud of doing. Something, so a lot of guys that will go into the trades or even veterans become first responders or first responders sometimes become veterans. You need something to give you purpose and something that challenges you, either mentally or physically. The reason why inspections turned out so great for me I feel is because, you know, like, like most guys, probably from my era, I have pretty significant ADHD. So I tend to like to think about a lot of different things at all times. But because of the military training, I was able to focus some of that. And for me, I like the challenge. I like learning, I like knowing more than the next guy and then learning from the guy that knows more than me. So I understand the hierarchy of experience. And, you know, it was something that was very hard earned, I felt, but because of that, I think it gives me a little bit of an advantage when it comes to being able to deal with difficult clients, difficult homes, you know, a lot of things happening at once, chaos, you know, you can walk into a house and just in you could easily become overwhelmed. But some of that discipline that you get in overwhelming situations can help calm that nerve. And I think it’s something that shows a lot in military veterans and first responders definitely.

Ian R
Yeah, you know, the one quality that I’ve always said is one of the best from anybody with those backgrounds. And I was telling this just recently to an ex police officer, and something that I had to learn in the inspection industry is how to command a room. So as a home inspector, if we walk in, kind of wussy, and we’re like, oh, well can I go in here now. Or, you know, we’re kind of, you know, we’re not commanding the room, the inspection gets away from us, clients telling us what to look at first, and we’re just doing what they tell us, going out of our pattern, probably missing things, if we’re used to doing the attic first, and then the bedrooms after and we’re switching it around, it messes up, at least me anyways, messes up my flow. And just any of those backgrounds that we mentioned before, you can kind of walk and you’re used to commanding the room, and you’re used to dealing with difficult people. And people are stressed out in those situations. And for me, my first years in my career, because I don’t have military, police, firefighter, anything background, I had to learn, okay, I need to control this situation as best I can. They’ve hired me to do my inspection. And these outside elements I need to control. Whereas when you have a background like yours, you kind of know, okay, there’s chaos. Where do we focus this. And that’s an advantage. That’s an advantage. And I think that’s advantage, an advantage, if anybody’s hiring a home inspector, say we’re expanding, you were just saying that your market’s picking up, markets are picking up all across the US and Canada, we’re seeing lots of good data, not flying off the charts, but at least it’s not the nosedive we saw last year, we talked about this on one of our recent podcasts. But as we do that, we might be thinking, okay, who should I hire? And a lot of times the first thing we think of is, how about that contractor buddy of mine? Or how about that HVAC contractor that I met on the inspection one time, maybe he’d like a side biz. Whether you’re listening and you’re thinking about going to the home inspection industry, as a veteran or as a firefighter, anything, that’s great. But as we’re hiring, think of those kinds of people too. Do you find that they are a good hire when you’ve hired them in the past?

Mike Ortiz
Yeah. So I think the best thing, if you can, I think most of these professions can identify that the structure that InterNACHI has, the standards of practice, SOP, there’s SOPs in the military. Basically, everything has a handbook, whatever job you have, you know, there’s a ranger handbook, there’s a snipers handbook, there’s, you know, there’s an infantry handbook, that tells you exactly what your job is, what you need to do, and how you need to do it. I think that something like that can give great comfort and structure to someone who has been used to having structure for their, the majority of their career in the military or as a first responder. And because of that structure, you’re able to kind of have these basic orders to follow. And even if you’re the one giving them to yourself, let’s say you’re a solo guy, I think it’s great because it, what it does is it gives you a set of rules that you have to follow, and then you can exceed them, and then expand your knowledge on them. And if you’re looking to work for another company, the way that you can stand out is by having that discipline to be able to say, you know, I’m not saying you have to become a Yes, man. I’m very much a big advocate of not being taken advantage of. So here’s the, here’s the only thing that you know, with, I can speak for veterans that I’ve seen, and I’ve met, including myself. We become kind of a doormat because we take orders so easily. And we’re the guy, like if you have a group of guys standing around the general civilian, you know, someone that doesn’t have any military background, and every, somebody comes in, a boss comes in and says, hey, I got this really big crawlspace, it’s muddy, I need somebody to go in there. Most guys won’t volunteer for that because they’re like, man, that sucks. I don’t get paid enough for this all that. Most military guys are just like, you know what? It sucks. I’ll do it, fine, because they’re used to crappy situations where you’re just forced to do something you don’t want to do, so they can already accept defeat right away and take that order. I think that’s the only thing that you might have to curtail. Because when you’re working for some of these larger companies, you know it, the home inspection industry is not immune to bad management. And you have to make sure that you protect yourself as far as what you’re, what you’re contributing versus what, how you’re being taken care of. I pride myself on making sure that I don’t, you know, go out of my way to just give pats on the back, but provide real value to anyone that works for me, that they see that I appreciate them, because, you know, they’re, you know, they’re in it for the money. And that’s a value that I give them. And anytime they do anything above and beyond what I expect of them, then that’s how I reward them. Not with pats on the back or birthday cake. But with, you know, hey, you did a great job, here’s some extra cash, here’s a bonus because you did a great job, I hope that you do in the future. And then what that shows him is that there’s a mutual respect, and that there’s an understanding that hey, while you, all you have to do is follow these basic orders, when you go above and beyond, you’ll be rewarded for that. Whereas in the military, it doesn’t matter how far beyond you go, I remember my first paycheck from the army, I think it was they give you a paycheck every first and 15th. So my first paycheck was 480 bucks. On the first two weeks away, I worked, you start at 5am. And you’re done at like 10pm, or your stay overnight and all that. And I was so happy to have that. And I think I got used to being happy to have that when I got out of the army. I went to get my first job. And I was like, oh, wait, you’re paying me what, 900 bucks for two weeks of work. That’s insane, I’ll work however much you need. I want to clock in for overtime, I was just going out of my way to people please. Because I thought that that’s what I was required to do. I think with hiring a veteran, hiring a first responder, you have to be mindful that they’ll do whatever they need to, to make sure that that they’re successful, and they work hard for you. Don’t forget to take care of them. And if you’re also going to be working for a bigger company, look out for your own well being and your own interests. Because unfortunately, even me as hard as I try, the first thing on my mind is, I hope they’re doing okay, I hope they’re, you know, that’s not the first thing on my mind, because I have a million other things I’m managing. So you know, accountability is a big one. But yeah, it’s definitely a great choice when you’re making a hire, because there’s that dedication. It’s just you know, you have to understand who it is you’re working with.

Ian R
You know, you said something in there, you said the home inspection industry is not immune to bad management. I would take that actually a step further, step further, I think the home inspection industry is more prone to bad management. And I say that because oftentimes people who start a company aren’t the people that do the work. Oftentimes, times they start a company and they, you know, like if you’re a tech company, you get money, you get investors and all that stuff. Or let’s say you start an HVAC company, and maybe it’s a family business or something like that. Yeah, but here, it’s usually, we’re a guy that does a really good job. And then we hire other people to help us. Oftentimes the business management kind of goes by the wayside. Because we were never built that way, we were built as somebody who could, you know, take care of the work and not necessarily the business. That’s why unfortunately, some home inspection companies hit a ceiling with their growth, because they, they need to be able to manage outside their business. Anyways, I digress. The reason I bring that up is we could measure our business acumen, how we run our business, if we do hire people with those backgrounds like a veteran, if they’re just kind of floundering, or they’re like, hey, man, just tell me what to do. They’re used to really good structure, the army, the military, in general, they’re used to working on structure and everything trickles down and is usually extremely orderly. So if they’re floundering, maybe we need to step back and say, oh, man, maybe I need to work on my structure. Do I have a handbook? Do I have an HR person? I think you mentioned them in the last podcast. When they do this, do they have an SOP to follow? If they did something wrong, did I not give them the right information? It’s actually a good gauge of our business.

Mike Ortiz
Yeah, and some unfortunately, I also with that advice, I also caution not to take it too far. So one of my biggest pet peeves, and it’s a private pet peeve, but you know, it’s okay to talk about, is that, you know, I see this a lot in corporate, even in medium to small sized companies. There’s this, this thinking of, you know, they compare, there’s a comparison to, let’s say, just an average work place and a military structure. An example would be when they use words like boots on the ground or you know, when salespeople talk about, you know, you see these videos, where they’re hyping each other up And they’re, they’re having these conferences, they’re like we got to attack, we have to, you know, this is a battleground, this is a, you know, it makes it there, what’s happening is that, you know, a lot of these influencers are like, you know, I’ll come onto your salesforce, and we’ll train them, and we’ll make them, you know, complete, you know, we’ll make them tacticians, we’ll make them, you know, warriors for your sales team. And it’s like, you, if you take it too far, then what happens is, is that there’s this disconnect with the, with either the veteran or either any regular employee that you have, is that you’re, what you’re doing is that you’re giving too much importance to too much seriousness to something that can be as easy as a conversation. You know, this, this, this, you know, if you send an email and say, hey, man, we gotta get boots on the ground, we got to battle this out and get this done and taken care of, we have a mission to accomplish. It’s like, okay, calm down, we’re just gonna go send out some flyers, you know, it’s really, it’s one of those things where you have to, you have to take it, you have to take, you know, because if you have good structure, then there’s no need for the extra, you know, fluff of that, it’s kind of like when you talk to, to chat GPT, and you ask it for some details, and you tell it no fluff, it removes those extra words that make it tell you these unnecessary, you know, what it does is it, it makes it to where if you’re an inspector, who all you’ve done is been an inspector, and you know how to do that really well, and you’re struggling to move into a management position to manage another inspector, you have to make sure that you understand that it’s, it is a relationship. But it’s not a personal one, it’s a professional one. And you have to limit how much, you know, how personal it can become, because you don’t want to pry into people’s lives. But you also have to understand that, at the same time, what you’re asking of someone is to follow your direction. And they’ll follow it willingly if you lead by example, they’ll follow it willingly if they see that you’re putting effort into your own roles and that your roles are clear. I make an effort to remind my guys that, hey, you know, here’s how the week’s gonna go, I have inspections in these areas, you guys have inspections in these areas, we’re all going to be out there today together, if you need anything, text me or call me, or you know, call my wife or however, however, they can do it quickly to get a hold of someone if we run into any snafus. And then we handle it task by task. But when you create these leadership roles, and I’ve seen it happen in companies before where it becomes a bit too serious, and they take it too serious, then there’s that disconnect. And you know, all employees will always complain about their bosses and about their work, you’re not going to be their best friend, because you’re going to make your own mistakes. And it’s they’re going to be the ones that pay for it. You know, whether it’s a late, late one day on payroll, or you forgot to put in a mileage report or something like that, you know, they’re going to blame you. And you have to take it with stride, you know, even when there’s mistakes, because there is going to be that phone call, hey, your inspector came out. And you know, the weather stripping on the front door is missing. And um, mosquitoes got in, you know, and then they get oh wow, I can’t believe, you know, did we get a thorough inspection and then, you know, you can use that and say, hey, dude, what the hell? You missed this? Or you can say, hey, I got a call, this was bound to happen, weatherstripping on the door, something I’ve missed, maybe once years ago, this is something that you can work on, I bet you it won’t happen again because it’s going to sear in your mind, hey, you know, I can’t believe I missed that. And now you can move forward. If it happens again, that’s a more serious conversation. But talking to veterans or first responders, they listen very well. And if you know, if you really develop a rapport, then you don’t have to deal with conflict like that.

Ian R
Yeah. And that’s, that’s a good point is basically it comes down to listening. And sometimes that’s, that’s the hardest part is, you tell somebody go inspect the attic, and you know, then they’re off in the kitchen, they’re like, oh, I’ll get to the attic after I’m done with the kitchen. And it’s just, you know, the, the listening, but also not taking it too far. You know, I was thinking about an example, there was a guy I was talking to, I don’t know, probably a couple years ago now. Do you get that thing, Mike, where you’re like, oh, this happened yesterday, and it was like three years ago, or five years ago, and it was like a month ago. So I don’t actually remember when at this point. But I was talking to this guy, and he’s a fireman. And he became a very successful home inspector as a one man show. He was at the max of what he could do, raised his prices, did the whole nine yards. And he called me about how to hire and who to hire. And he was looking at all sorts of people. And I’m like, aren’t you a fireman? He goes yeah, yep. He was, he was semi-retired. He goes, I do, you know, two 12 hour shifts or something like that. And then the rest of my week is inspecting. And I’m like, are there other guys out there that work three days in a row and then have four days off? He goes, yeah, that’s our standard schedule. And I’m like, aren’t firemen really good at climbing ladders, taking orders, used to being wet and dirty and overheated. And he’s like, oh, man, you’re describing home inspectors. I’m like, yeah. And so that’s what he does now is he hires within his firehouse. There’s another guy that I know, won’t say where he is, he did that without me telling him to do that. He’s just like man, you know, firefighters and police officers, they make great home inspectors. And same thing with veterans, there’s some veteran owned companies that only hire other veterans, because they know they can trust them, they know that they’re going to work hard, and they’re going to get things done, and they’re gonna listen. And you don’t have to, you don’t have to tell certain people twice. You know, and I think people would those backgrounds, you tell them once, and they’re like, got it. And you don’t have to worry about the in between stuff, you know what I mean?

Mike Ortiz
Yeah, that’s the thing is just being clear and clear with what your expectations are, not beating around the bush, and being direct is very much respected. Beating around the bush is very much seen as a sign of weakness in the military. You know, if you don’t give a direct, you know, like, you tell me, you need me to do something, I’ll do it, you know, but don’t say, you know, if I don’t do something and say, well, I thought you would do this? Well, then the customer was like, hey, well, we weren’t told to do this, you know, you, it comes down to being direct and being honest, and doesn’t have to be rude or blunt, it doesn’t have to be you know, you don’t, there, there should be no, there’s no room for ego when you’re managing people. You have to be willing to learn, you have to be willing to listen, you got to remember some of these guys that you’re hiring, if they’re, if this is their, they did their five years or four years in the military, and they’re looking for something else, you know, they have, they at least made it to a leadership role near the end of their five, six years. So they at least made it to a role where they were in charge of at least two to three people, okay. And that with itself comes with, that comes with a little bit of pride and a little bit of ego, that they can take orders. But at the same time, they don’t want to be babied either, they want to be able to be given responsibility and then be entrusted that they have enough discipline to follow their job accordingly. So you give them guidance, you show them what you do, and then everything will work out. And you know, one of the big things that I see is, you know, there are a lot of programs out there, if you have trouble, you can’t just go out and just like start screaming out any veterans looking for work, you know what I mean? There’s, there are great places. And here in California, I know that I’ve used the SkillBridge Program, which is a program for transitioning military personnel that the SkillBridge pays their salary or their their hourly rate up to a certain amount of time while they’re working in training with you. So basically, they cover those couple months of pay while they’re training and even starting out, and then you can take over once they’re fully trained and then you hire them on as an employee. The program is meant to help veterans transition from you know, being military. And there’s also other ones like Helmets to Hardhats, things like that. And then, you know, your local VA, there’s a lot of local VA chapters, and veteran resource centers where you can put job listings up on boards, and you know, and again, as with anything else, like with construction, first responders, whatever it is, just because they are a veteran, just because, doesn’t automatically mean they’re great. You know.

Ian R
Yeah, exactly.

Mike Ortiz
When I was in the army, there were some pretty bad eggs, you know what I mean, guys that I wouldn’t trust, you know, as far as I could throw em, and there’s, you know, but that’s far and few between, and then obviously, you know, and obviously, we come with a lot of stigma, okay. You know, it’s, you know, I, I don’t know, any other veteran who’s gone to war to Iraq or Afghanistan and has seen combat like I myself have, and my friends have, and doesn’t come back with some kind of wound, whether it’s visible or not. And that stigma is obviously attached to all of us. And we understand that 100% I know. I have family that’s in law enforcement as well. And there are stigmas that come with that, you know what I mean? And I think everybody loves firefighters. So that’s not fair. But still, you know, it’s like, it’s one of those things. It’s, it’s, you know, there are stigmas attached to each of those professions, you know, and because of that, there’s that fear, like, oh, they just, they’re gonna see me as some crazy PTSD veteran and not hire me. So they’re, you know, there’s always that, you always have that disadvantage and feeling of, of not being looked at, you know, with a fair lens, even though a lot of companies try to make their best. They, you know, they give extra points and interviews and stuff like that for veterans and we, everybody greatly appreciates that. There’s still that stigma. And you know, it’s unfortunate but it’s, it’s, it’s standard out there that I’ve seen.

Ian R
Yeah, you know, it’s funny though, before this podcast, I was going over home inspectors that I know, home inspection company owners. And listen, we’re not saying, if you’re not a veteran firefighter, police officer, whatever, you’re not going to make a good home inspector, it comes down to the person. But there are some advantages. You said, if you were in the military, let’s say, four or five years, you would be almost guaranteed to have at some point been in a leadership role. So you could have somebody at 22 years old already having experience leadership roles in a high intensity situation. I mean, what, what 22 year old does that? I mean, it’s hard to find anybody with leadership experience. So like, oh, okay, well, I was a leader of a three person sales team for Cisco. It’s like, we sold phones, and I worked by myself and these other two people did, do whatever, you know, there’s a difference between I have direct contact, and I’m leading leading people. So there’s some advantages in there. Like I said, I use myself as an example. I’m a successful home inspector. But to be frank, there were a couple of years there where I had to learn something that somebody would have already learned who was a military, police officer, firefighter. But anyways, I digress. I’m thinking of one of the biggest home inspection companies, I won’t say the states because they’ll have people figure out who they are. But I’m looking at my map of clients and basically just home inspector friends in the industry. Some of the larger companies in the country in the US, I don’t have much data on Canada at the moment, are run by veterans, firefighters, ex-police officers, and first responders. I would, I would say better than half of the ones I’m looking at right now. So that’s saying something. We’re thought of as an industry made up of, you know, ex-contractors like me. But yeah, you know, you listen to the show, Jay Wynn, he’s an ex-contractor. And me and him always joke we had to unlearn being contractors, and that that took time. So any ex-contractors out there, if you’re struggling right now wondering why people aren’t getting your inspection, or maybe we’ve already learned this looking back saying, yeah, I get what Ian’s saying, we had to unlearn bad habits. We walk into a room, kind of not pay attention to the people around us, give an estimate and walk out. We’re looking at, we’re looking at things from a different angle, we have to stop, step back and say, okay, there’s people here, how do I bring the room together? How do I command the room? What are the vital things? I’m going to find problems. How am I going to convey this information? It’s a different skill set.

Mike Ortiz
Yeah.

Ian R
So knowing how to fix something and recognizing defects and bridging the technical to the human, very different skill set. It’s an advantage for anybody who was a veteran, or in any of those other backgrounds, because you’re used to that, even talking about police officers. So I mean, a police officer has to walk into other people’s homes a lot of the time, command a room with difficult people who are at their worst emotionally.

Mike Ortiz
That sounds like a real estate transaction.

Ian R
Yeah, it sounds like a real estate transaction. Right. And they have to find things that are wrong, not fix the issue, but identify them, convey the information properly, and then write a report about it later. I literally just described the home inspection.

Mike Ortiz
Yep, and nobody’s happy at the end. So that’s it.

Ian R
And nobody’s happy, and you have to be okay with that. You have to be, and let’s be frank about our job too, you have to have no squishiness. If we are squishy, and somebody calls us a doodoo head and a bad home inspector, yeah, that can bother us, maybe we have some pride, whatever. But we have to be used to being called all sorts of horrible names behind our back, people saying things, we have to have some grit, you know, and that takes time to develop, if you can develop that before you get into the home inspection industry, more power to you because man I’ve been called some awful things.

Mike Ortiz
Yeah, I think it comes down to, you have to be, you can be disciplined but there are, there are little victories you can have, you know, I think the month or two ago, listing agent was beyond extremely rude and dismissive of me, right, doing the inspection. Okay. And I’m used to dealing with listing agents that don’t want me there at all. But you know, there are little things that I do to make it more fun for myself, you know, so I go in, and it’s already, it’s a little bit of a warm day out here it’s like 85 degrees so that means the house is around that because AC hasn’t been on, listing agent’s inside, you know, relaxed, comfortable, and you know, they’re just being rude and not you know, all that in which you know, I’ve had that before and as I turn on the AC, test it, test the registers, you know, temperature difference, all that, and then I turn on the heat to about 85 degrees and then just leave it like that for the bout an hour and a half.

Ian R
We’re not endorsing smoking out your rude agents, folks. Still, quite funny.

Mike Ortiz
I love how they say oh, looks like the heat works, I’m like yeah, I’ve just got to check it for a little while longer, I’m gonna go to look at the furnace, see how the burners look, I went into the attic, and I laid down next to the furnace, and I look with my flashlight and took my time, every burner, every flame, and then I hear them walk upstairs, hey, you’re done testing the heater? Oh, I’m still evaluating the heaters, they’re like okay, and they’re just like sweating, you know, dripping, I’m already used to it. I’m sweating in the attic. I’m like, this is fine, I can accept this, but they were not expecting with the way they were dressed to be sweating like this and hating life and all that, because it’s warm outside, it’s hot inside, so little victories you know, help me with morale, I guess. But you know, that’s, that’s stuff that comes with experience and time.

Ian R
You want an Ian side story, as David likes to call it on our show here? So one of my very first inspections in my career, I was inspecting a boiler, and I live in the northeast, you know, our heating units are a little bit more important than, you know, some parts of the southern country. So I turn the heating unit on, and I’ll let it run for about five minutes. And this particular type of boiler has an inlet valve for the water. And it was, it was clogged. So it had just enough water in it to run for about 10 minutes. And then and then over, it would have a gauge that would it would overheat. And then it would turn itself off. So I would let it run for eight or nine minutes on a hot summer day. And I’m like, everything worked fine, was beautiful, and it wasn’t my fault, quote, unquote, unless I took that pipe off and saw or ran it for over 9, 10 minutes. And my clients didn’t blame me. But afterwards, they’re like, oh, the HVAC guy said you would never have found it this or that. On the hottest summer day, I will run every AC unit for 15 to 25 minutes. And people hate my guts when it’s 97 and I’m running the heating unit. And I’m like, well, you know what, it’s never, it’s literally never happened again after 1000s of inspections. It was a freak accident. But just a little side story of, you know, letting the heating unit run even if you’re gonna smoke people out.

Mike Ortiz
It’s always like that, I run, I run a dishwasher cycle, everything drains, and then they move in, and then their dishwasher leaks. It’s like, okay, you know, you struggle with what to say, you’re like, you know, oh, on the normal cycle it’s fine. For some reason, when we put the steam on or whatever, it starts leaking. And I say okay, well, you know, and then come to find out, it’s just the seal between the door and the dishwasher that’s different when the steam is on. And I was like, okay, well, you know, that’s not something I could have known. But you feel for people in those situations. And then you know, but they try not, their hardest not to blame you. But then you know, sometimes you’ll deal with actual you know, Karen’s, unfortunately, that there’s, you know, there’s a lot of red flags, when you go into an inspection. Well, they’re like, hey, do you offer a warranty? Do you have E&O insurance? Do you have liability? I’m like, man, I don’t even know if I want to schedule this inspection at all.

Ian R
Exactly. Those are, those are big red flags.

Mike Ortiz
Yeah, I’m like the inspection fee will be $1,900. And yes, we have all that. I have some extra forms for you to sign too.

Ian R
Exactly. Do you, that’s another side point. I always took pictures of every data plate on every appliance. And I took a picture of the appliance. Most, most of the extra pictures, they just go into my file. I’ve had many times, not just a few, many times where people have switched out the appliances. And one time where a person switched out the heating unit.

Mike Ortiz
Oh wow.

Ian R
And they’re like this thing is so old, you said it was, it was five years old. And I’m like, that’s not the same heating unit. I’m like, check your report. And here’s the pictures, and they’re like, oh my gosh, you’re right. Thank you. And that was the end of it for my end of things. So I always take, just a, do you do that or no?

Mike Ortiz
Yeah. So we take pictures of everything, we’ve learned. Okay, so recently, we had a client upset. They’re like, they’ll leave a, they left the voicemail saying, hey, you know, if, you know, I would like my inspection fee refunded, or I’m going to have to go to my attorney because I had to pay about $10,000 worth of repairs. I was like, okay, well, if you’re, you’re telling me you’d be okay if I just gave you the 500 bucks back versus getting $10,000 out of me for some repairs that are my fault. Let’s look into it. And it turns out, you know, there was an access to a hidden part of the crawlspace, like a sectioned part off the crawlspace that was in a closet. And you know, it, it had a bunch of personal items in it. But, you know, because the photo of the closet interior wasn’t in the report because there was no defects, it’s just a closet. It wasn’t, you know, they were like, oh, well, I don’t see anything about this access point in the report. They missed it, you know. And so we go back to our photos, and we’re like, oh, look, here’s that closet you’re talking about and the floor is completely covered with personal items including all this stuff and you know, wall to wall stuff. And it’s like, oh, wow, you got, you got me. You know, that’s what they said. It’s like, so it’s really one of those situations where we take, because of situations like that we take pictures of everything. We take pictures while we’re testing with the FLIR, the thermal imaging gun, of the oven, of the register. So the returns of all the walls and windows, everything. And every time we turn something off, we take a picture of our finger on the off button. So for the oven, the AC, everything else, because we get those calls. Hey, you left the oven on. Nope, here’s the photo. Hey, you did this, there’s a hole in the wall. I’m like, no, they did that when they were moving out because there was no hole when we were there. You know, stuff like that. It’s unfortunate, but it happens a lot.

Ian R
Oh it does. I probably told this story too. Took a picture of a fridge, of a wine fridge. And showed that it was on everything was fine. Somebody must have turned it off after I left because I videotaped my, I always videotape myself going out of the inspection. And I turned it off as my vehicle pulls away. So they tried to get me for six grand worth of wine that went bad. And I’m like, well, here’s the picture and the video. And you can see the fridge in the video too, of me leaving the property. So, and I remember the listing agent ended up paying for it. And he goes, you got me good there. I’m like, I didn’t get anybody. I’m just..Anyways, we digress.

Mike Ortiz
Yeah. All right. Well, everybody makes mistakes. Because my last little one, my very first inspection, my very first one, I tested an outlet in the garage for GFI, and it did not have the reset button on it. And yeah, and I, and then the groceries went bad in the fridge in the garage. So I ended up having to pay, well not having to pay, I offered to pay to replace all the groceries, thank goodness they didn’t have some wagyu you know, $800 an ounce steak in there or something. But, you know, I was like, that was 100% something that I never tested, I never tested an outlet after that, that wasn’t specific, like I wasn’t able to trace back or anything. That’s where I learned that lesson, you know, and that, you know, I never thought of before. But you know, you learn like that by making those mistakes.

Ian R
Yeah, it’s a rookie, I’ve made that mistake before too. But going back to like veterans, firefighters, police officers, first responders, to kind of sum some things up, what do you think might be holding some of them back from entering the home inspection industry? Or why might some hesitate to hire them? Or what are some last bits of advice that you could give? Anything to kind of sum up our subject here.

Mike Ortiz
Um, most people looking to hire home inspectors like myself, they’re not looking for someone that’s been doing home inspections. This is a field where we actually, I actually prefer not having someone that’s been inspecting for a long time when it comes to experience, because even though we all follow the same SOP, I do inspections completely different than my competitors, we all do. So I want someone that I can, I don’t have to brush away bad habits, I can give them like the core of how I do things. And you know, there’s that fear of like, if I don’t have any experience doing this, then I don’t want to apply for this job and be let down and all that stuff. No, I actually right, today is the 23rd of April, right? I’m looking to hire in Los Angeles, right now, if you’re a veteran, you can send your resume to me because I need someone that is willing to work and learn and be trained and go on ride alongs. And it’s gonna be, it’s gonna suck because it’s the summer, I hate training in the summer. But, you know, it’s one of those things that, you shouldn’t have that fear of reaching out. There’s a lot of inspection companies that are out there. And there’s like just one guy and a couple guys just like me. And we’re always looking because it gets busy. And, you know, there are the big inspection companies as well that work more like what you’re probably used to with big structure and all that if you’re comfortable with that, you know, but the fear of you know, I put my job listings on Indeed, or I put them sometimes on Facebook, but with those, you don’t really get good responses, or the kinds of responses that you want. And you need to really look out there, there are companies that are hiring right now. And you know, the only thing that really I look for is just having the certification, InterNACHI shows me that you’re committed to doing the work because honestly, the certification by itself is just the baseline, and then we have to grow you from there. And so it is starting over doing something different, but there shouldn’t be a fear. You know, we’re not, we don’t judge based on what service you were in or your age or anything. It’s really just, you know, getting to know you, getting to know what you can do. And it’s a lot of driving, you know, it’s a lot of you know, I guess if you’re a veteran looking to get into home inspections, it comes down to, the home inspection part honestly becomes the easiest part, okay, it becomes the easiest part after a while. You, this job isn’t for you if you’re not a little bit interested in learning new things every day. There isn’t a day that goes by where I don’t learn something new or change the way I thought of something. That literally happens to me every day in this job, I completely either change the way I’ve seen something before or learn something new that I didn’t know before. Because we’re not just, we’re not responsible for knowing, you know, I feel like it’s funny that plumbers or electricians or roofers will come out, and they’re surprised, how do you not know all this stuff about the roof? Like, you know, like, the way we install them nowadays. And I’m like, well, you know, if it’s something really specific, or a really specific code reference from an electrician, I tell him like, man, look, I got to know all the electrical as much as I can, and the plumbing, and the roof, and the HVAC and the foundation, and the framing and everything else. It’s really just, you have to be, you have to be inquisitive, you have to ask questions. And a lot of companies hiring, we look for stuff like that, managers look for someone that’s like, you know, they’re not just be, they’re not waiting to be told what to do, they are also asking a lot of questions, because they’re genuinely interested in the job. And this is a job that requires a little bit of passion to do it, you know, you are helping people, and you are making money for doing it. And you don’t have to make or fix anything, which is great, the best part of the job, you just walk in and point everything out. But I think that veterans or first responders, or looking for this type of work, it can seem daunting, you know, it can seem like there’s so much you have to know, but it really comes down to sticking to your SOP, taking as much knowledge as you can from whoever’s training you, pulling out as much value as you can from the ride alongs, making an effort to be flexible, to a point where you know you can go to these ride alongs, you can commit because if you show commitment to me, then I’m obliged to be committed to you. And therefore, you know, we work well together. But yeah, I mean, it’s, it’s, it’s not scary. It’s definitely not the scariest thing you’ve ever been through, that’s for sure. You know. So yeah, send that resume in, you know, apply for that job. Because, you know, as time goes by, it’s a necessity, people are going to need it. AI is not taking over, you crawl, you have to smell, you use all your senses. You listen for things wrong, you smell for things wrong, you can touch, you know, and you can touch a drain and see if it’s wet. You can you know, you can smell a gas leak, you know, there’s a lot of things that are involved in being a home inspector. So it’s an industry that’s hot right now. If you haven’t started a company, start a company now if you’re going to do that, if you want to think about working for an inspection company, apply to all of them as much as you can, and get the first one that takes you, go for it. Because you know what, if it doesn’t work out, you can just move to another one. If it doesn’t work out, move, if this is what you’re passionate about doing, then do it. Because honestly, I wouldn’t be where I was, if it wasn’t for my ability to be curious about all the workings of a building. You know, and this is a great opportunity for people that are transitioning out of military.

Ian R
Mike, as always, thank you very much for sharing your insight and expertise. And anybody listening, who has any of those backgrounds that we mentioned, listen to Mike. And thank you very much for being on the show. We look forward to having you on again.

Mike Ortiz
Sounds good. Thanks.

Outro: On behalf of myself, Ian, and the entire ITB team, thank you for listening to this episode of Inspector Toolbelt Talk. We also love hearing your feedback, so please drop us a line at [email protected].

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